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Match day discussion, transfers, and all things Accies

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Postby TerracingTomas » Wed May 12, 2021 9:37 pm

So now we know short of a 9 goal victory over Killie, we are relegated. Three factors IMO have contributed to our demise viz the squad, the manager and injuries. You can put your own weight on which was the most influential but for me it’s about taking account of the whole season.

1. The Squad

We assembled possibly the weakest squad of our 7 seasons in the Premiership. With the smallest budget, retention and recruitment has to be spot on yet we persevered with the likes of McKenna, Fjortoft and Cunningham from last season despite ample evidence suggesting they should have been released in the summer freeing up wages. We promoted 6 youth players to the first team and whatever their potential, none of them have established themselves this season despite the club congratulating itself because we played young players for more minutes in the Premiership than any other team. The other teams of course haven’t been relegated! Then there was our summer recruitment. We paid a nominal fee for Tunde who obviously didn’t impress Rice as he only made 7 league appearances and 6 of those were substitutions. Next Justin Johnston, 5 league appearances of which 4 were substitutions. Not surprisingly he was released as was Tunde. Another example of our speculative punt approach to signings Ben Stirling. Why? I acknowledge the success of Odoffin and Callaghan and I’m not downplaying the likes of Jamie Hamilton who came good this season and Fulton who proved to be less of a disaster than anticipated but the negatives far outweigh the positives. The lack of depth in the squad was exposed in November when the injury crisis really hit. We had to resort to signing out of contract players (Thomas and Martin)who weren’t match fit not having played since the previous season so their impact wasn’t anywhere immediate. And come January when we usually sign a few to bolster our escape act we signed ONE player all be it initially a reasonable striking option in Anderson.

2. The Manager

I don’t know about his win ratio but as he has overseen our relegation then for me Rice has a worse record than Canning. When he arrived I think the majority of us thought he was going to be a success. Last season dissuaded me and many others of that notion, as the football quickly resorted to form. This season showed no improvement and the humiliating losses to Annan and Stranraer followed by the 8 - 0 Rangers thrashing would have seen most managers shown the door but not Accies. Ronnie and Co. show remarkable loyalty to managers, particularly when they play the youngsters even if it’s only 15 minute cameos. Rice looked a broken man post Rangers and after the Midden cup game I genuinely feared for his mental health. At the end of the day he oversaw the assembly of that squad, he is responsible for the coaching, tactics and team selection and he has failed in his tenure to date to improve the first team. In fact he has overseen their relegation. Will he be there next season. Well we know the answer to that.

3. Injuries

First of all when we sign players who have an injury history whatever their providence there is a high risk that that there will be a reoccurrence or fresh injury and so it proved with Temps. Even before the season began we had 3 long term injuries on the books I.e. Oggie, Easton and Collar. By the time Collar had returned he obviously wasn’t part of the managers’ plans and was released after half a dozen performances. When we have players who have been out with a serious injury we probably rush them back too soon as they don’t last e.g. Oggie and Martin. As for the others too numerous too mention was it the pitch, our training methods or just random bad luck. I honestly have no idea. Even the players we signed in November when they were judged match fit have been lost to us for large periods. Nathan Thomas made his first appearance 4 weeks after we signed him and then was largely absent since December with a knee injury.

Taking all the above into account is it really a surprise this was the season the chickens came home to roost? I will acknowledge coved hasn’t helped either finances or football operations and that’s an understatement but every club has been similarly affected and I hold up exhibit A, Livingston Fc. Not much of a player budget more than us but look what they achieved so our relegation wasn’t inevitable had we recruited wisely, and sacked Rice. Que sera.
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Re: Down Down Down

Postby Beardy » Wed May 12, 2021 9:50 pm

Cannae argue with any of that TT. Sad to witness it but the writing was on the wall for a long time. With the impending financial crisis at the club I can't see any major investment going in to the squad buy maybe a season or two in the championship where the accies have a greater chance of winning a few games will help.
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Postby Tumbleweed.. » Wed May 12, 2021 9:58 pm

You have 2 too many reasons there.

A manager who performed worse than Martin Canning was something most of us thought was impossible. Yet that has happened.

His bravado on appointment was a breath of fresh air, unfortunately, that has turned into the overpowering, all pervasive stench of fresh cut, grade A, never ending, premium sh!t. He has proved himself to be out of his depth, but has sorted that by going down a level where he might just about be in his depth. I have totally lost interest after decades of mostly nonsense, and if I look at it objectively, there is only 1 reason for that, from which everything else flows.

As I said, you have 2 too many reasons.
On the outskirts of nowhere, on the ring road to somewhere, on the verge of indecision, I'll always take the roundabout way.
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Re: Down Down Down

Postby Begs.hafc » Wed May 12, 2021 10:11 pm

We don't deserve to stay up. End of. But it was fun while it lasted!!!! Maybe win a few games next season?
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Postby porcupine » Wed May 12, 2021 10:13 pm

As we both have consistently said this season, our time in the sun was well and truely up, and we escaped last year only by the early Covid season closure. Lady Luck was nowhere to be seen.

All your points are fully valid, TT. Poor recruitment, players signed with known injury histories. too many youngsters, and a loss of key players to other clubs due to our financial position. A manager that has proven to be out of his depth at this level has compounded the situation. He should consider his position, as they say in politics.

There's something positive in playing in the Championship next season. We might be able to compete and win games, though there are a lot of good outfits that wiould give us stiff opposition even with the present squad. Many of those will not be re-signed in all probability. There is the real danger of dropping right through a Championship season however, and I would not be surprised if we do a Falkirk, who have far better support, resources, and probably far better financially controlled than Accies.

For those that have known nothing other than Premiership football with Hamilton, this relegation will be seen as a disaster. Those of us who have seen the Club sink into the Fourth Tier and battle back out again over the years, can enjoy a real day out in many new parts of Scotland without the bigotry of the Glasgow Two. Great stovies at East Fife springs to mind.

Realistically, we are now at a level which is probably where we should be competing, as the last few years have hardly given us regular winning streaks, other than the few Alex Neil months we had at the start of this journey.

It'll be an interesting summer, with departures, (perhaps even our Stadium CEO?) and a cloth cutting exercise in all that is required at this time.

Of course, we might still beat Killy 9-0 on Saturday, even with Lafferty, and beat the Dee in the Play-Offs :lol:
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Re: Down Down Down

Postby smc4761 » Wed May 12, 2021 10:38 pm

Totally agree with what has been said so far with the exception of, TT point that many of us thought he would be a success. Dont know if I am in a minority but I always thought he was the cheap option. No previous managerial experience as a No 1 and a failed St Midden No 2 who got booted out fairly quickly

We have been hammered by injuries and that in the main was the downfall. However 2 big games cost us dearly this season. 1-0 to county with about 5 minutes to play and lost 2-1. Followed a few weeks later 1-0 against st Johnstone and losing a last minute goal. So instead of 6 points we got 1. Had we held out our destiny would be in our own hands

Manager out of his depth, fans disillusioned with club, board not giving a feck about the fans, I would imagine even less money next season. Its not a good combination and I fear we will have years in wilderness

Alex Neil left 6 years ago and the team on park has not gone forward, in fact it is terminal decline. Canning and Rice have appalling win ratios about 20%, how Rice is still there and with a new contract is beyond me, unless its the board sticking 2 fingers up to fans.

And what of our wonderful youth academy, apart from Greg Docherty, in past 6 years or so, we have made nothing out of moving any of the others on for any cash

Will we come straight back up, to be honest I doubt it
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Re: Down Down Down

Postby Big Wurzil » Thu May 13, 2021 6:31 am

I just found it staggering and still do at his appointment.

55 and a no2 at the team sitting bottom and with no managerial experience and he gets the job. He then keeps cannings right hand man as his right man too so we were always in trouble from day 1.

You telling me 2 years ago there wasn't a player for example a 'Scott brown' who's been doing his badges in the background and actively looking for a coaching role who can bring in fresh ideas with a possible "auld heid" mentor behind the scenes, similar to what Walter smith has been doing with Gerrard.

An I'm not convinced that that squad will stay in the championship as we will lose the bulk of it and the ones that stay won't be up for the fight of a game at Palmerston etc as they've shown in the betfred cup.
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Postby Euan » Thu May 13, 2021 8:14 am

At half time, I thought we would do it and again when St Mirren made it 2-2, but no, we’re finally relegated.
If we can hold on to most of the squad and with better luck regarding injuries we may bounce back. A lot depends on how much investment the board are willing to commit to. We’ll know by the time season 21/22 comes around what to expect.
Regarding the Youth System, it’s not provided an endless supply of saleable assets but it continues to produce some decent players and is responsible for one of my favourite Accies moments ever, beating Basle in the Champions League in front of a packed NDP. For that alone I am reluctant to criticise it.
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Postby YeOldeHamiltonian » Thu May 13, 2021 1:33 pm

I am still devastated at going down as a see this as a continuation of a very slippery slope with no bottom in sight.

Unlike years ago,it is a financial catastrophe going down-especially this season.

Loss of SPL top flight income,reduced sponsorship,reduced Hospitality,less season tickets sold/away fans,£400k drop yearly from South Lanarkshire Council and all saleable assets will be off.

We will be watching The likes of Ronan Hughes replace Odoffin and the vast drop in player quality will lead to even further drops in attendances,sponsorships and Hospitality.

Losing 3-1 at home to Arbroath in a relegation battle next year in front of 485 fans on Friday night TV will make this year look like a wonderland.

This to me is as serious as the Watson years as the gulf between the Owners and fans is as bad as then.We have lost many fans and potential fans since Alex Neil left.

Alex Neil offered hope and ambition;something that has been missing in most of my 45 seasons supporting the club.

That is all we want-sustainable ambition.This was done without splashing vast amounts of cash and clubs like St.Johnstone and Livvy prove it can be done now with good stewardship,Management and recruitment on a limited budget.

Absolutely scunnered.
Last edited by YeOldeHamiltonian on Thu May 13, 2021 9:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Down Down Down

Postby TerracingTomas » Thu May 13, 2021 1:44 pm

I suspect they are gambling on selling Hamilton YOH to soften the financial blow. They really only have this summer to capitalise on him. If he’s still here by next January he can sign a pre contract and Accies only get a development fee. For all we know a potential deal has been agreed with someone.
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Re: Down Down Down

Postby smc4761 » Thu May 13, 2021 8:05 pm

On Clyde 1 tonight, Accies supporter Ben, who runs a Accies blog was on. Gave a good account of the shambles that the club is, how we should be expecting more, how Rice got an extension was betond hime and criticising the clubs signing, or lack of policy

Media guys of course trying to defend the club, small budget blah blah, but fair do's to Ben for not accepting this and stuck to his guns
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Re: Down Down Down

Postby YeOldeHamiltonian » Thu May 13, 2021 9:20 pm

Caller after Ben was an Accie also;David from Hamilton.

He reiterated Ben's point about awarding Rice a new contract and also mentioned a pertinant point about signing players and then constantly losing them due to showing no ambition.
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Postby TerracingTomas » Fri May 14, 2021 4:06 pm

The podcast for Thursdays’ Scoreboard can be found here. Ben comes across very well. Calm, rationale, not like some of the old firm zoomers you usually here on that programme. It’s a bit into the programme sorry didn’t take a note of the exact position.

https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cH ... IBhAF&ep=6
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